[00:00:01.410] – Mickey Serebnitski
Awesome. Josiah, welcome to Beyond Page One. My name is Mickey. I’m your host today. Beyond Page One podcast is all about exploring the deeper meetings behind the business, going beyond the page, beyond the cover, so to speak, talking to entrepreneurs, leaders in their community, and their businesses, trying to identify what it is that they’ve done to achieve the success that they have. So today we have Josiah. He is the Chief Operating Officer and President of Public Affairs at Guardian Law Group LLP in Calgary, Alberta. So just, yeah, welcome to Zia.
[00:00:34.360] – Josiah Tweedie
Happy to be here, Mickey. Excited to answer some questions and tell you a bit about myself.
[00:00:41.630] – Mickey Serebnitski
Awesome. Let’s just hop right in then. What drew you to the legal field Particularly personal injury and general litigation?
[00:00:47.760] – Josiah Tweedie
I guess it was like, I’ve always said that I’ve had two main interests or vocations, I guess, in my life. One of them has been law, just the theory of law and everything that that entails. I’ve just always found that fascinating, how we govern, how we resolve disputes, all things like that. Always found that interesting. Then the other part, the other vocation that I have is tech. In my hobbyist life, which is increasingly difficult to keep up with these days, I’ve built my own personal PCs. I customize my machine as much as I reasonably feel comfortable with doing. I do a bit of programming on the side, just purely from a hobby perspective, not a professional at all. But again, it’s just something that I’ve always found fascinating. I’m like, How does this work? How can I leverage this? Is there a better way to do what I’m currently doing? So I’ve just always had those two vocations. But what has happened, I think, almost naturally in the last several years is that I’m using both of those vocations in my current role more and more. And I’d say possibly even the tech side of things, the tech side of things, which has been and just on a hobbyist level, is now being demanded, I’d say more and more in my current role.
[00:02:34.080] – Josiah Tweedie
I’m excited about that. I’m going to be going back to school with a computer science degree just because I thought, you know what? Why not?
[00:02:47.710] – Mickey Serebnitski
Very cool. Was there a specific case or person that influenced your path into the legal field? Or was it more like just applying for a job and getting it?
[00:02:57.700] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, I think it was just more I wanted to find a way where I could see how this industry worked.
[00:03:05.930] – Mickey Serebnitski
Embrace those, too.
[00:03:06.420] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. What better way to do that than to just jump in? I’m not one of those people that had a set career path and was like, Oh, I’m going to be a lawyer. Oh, I’m going to be a tech person. I just stumbled into it. Some might say, Well, okay, that’s a bit unwise. I might agree with them to an extent. I don’t know. I’ve just found the practice of learning enjoyable, and I learn something new every single day.
[00:03:36.110] – Mickey Serebnitski
Very cool. If you could go back in time and give your younger self a piece of advice for entering the workforce or this world, what would it be?
[00:03:46.360] – Josiah Tweedie
I think I would have said to myself, maybe try to nail down three or four paths that I could take, and then that would make me less scattered. I would say, which I think would have saved me a lot of effort and headache. But at the same time, I don’t have regrets. I’m happy with how it turned out. It was just a happy accident of like, Oh, here we are. I’m pleased with that. But yeah, I’ve tried to be less scattered these days, which I think everyone appreciates.
[00:04:24.410] – Mickey Serebnitski
Yeah. Well, I feel like it’s probably hard because balancing the roles of the COO and President of Public Affairs seems pretty demanding, right?
[00:04:32.360] – Josiah Tweedie
It is. It’s something that if you asked me, even two years ago, if you asked me, Are you capable of doing that? I probably would have said, Oh, no, not at all. I don’t know anything about that. But what I’m learning is that there are lots of things that we don’t know how to do, but the only way to do it is because there’s no class you can just take for either of those roles. You just have to jump in. But I should also say, that I benefit greatly from guidance from people who know way more than I do, in no small part due to my boss, Jonathan Denis, even though he hates the word boss. He not only has had a long career in the practice of law, but he’s also had a very varied and exciting career as a politician in the public sector. So he has given me a lot of guidance, trying to improve my soft skills such as communication, people management, things like that. So all of that, I chalk up a good portion of what I’ve learned to him because, again, there is There’s no class.
[00:06:01.420] – Josiah Tweedie
You either figure it out yourself or you benefit from someone who’s been there.
[00:06:07.070] – Mickey Serebnitski
Yeah. I think something that our listeners and I appreciate, too, is the idea of mentorship and how important it is. I often reflect to being this saying where it says, If you’re the smartest person in the room, you’re in the wrong room. It sounds like with your boss, so to speak, having someone as a mentor like that has been helpful in your career path as well.
[00:06:33.160] – Josiah Tweedie
Hugely. He’s been nothing but open and approachable like, this is typically how we do this or This is what you can expect in this situation, which is invaluable. Again, there’s no training for that. If you asked me three years ago, does that career path exist? I’d be like, No, what are you talking about? But it does exist, and it has existed for a while, so I’m lucky that I get to be a part of it. Yeah.
[00:07:05.380] – Mickey Serebnitski
It seems like more and more companies nowadays have people who wear many different hats. So how do you maintain a work-life balance when having so many things on the go?
[00:07:18.740] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. Work-life balance is a challenge. So I guess I should say there are two main hats to the role. There’s the internal practice, which is my COO role. I do things like hire and create policy and do some basic bookkeeping and just how the businesses run. As far as the public affairs side, that is client work that I do, and Jonathan does as well, obviously, with his guidance. Those are the two main hats that I typically wear. I say that there are probably about four or five more hats that I also wear. But yeah, as far as work-life balance, I am usually on the go at any given moment. The reality of managing a business is it needs you quite a lot. I’m always checking my phone for emails. I’m always checking text from people within. And it’s something that some might say, Oh, well, there’s very little work-life balance. But I see it as something that I’m passionate about and that I want to give 150, 160 %.
[00:08:49.110] – Mickey Serebnitski
That’s awesome.
[00:08:50.000] – Josiah Tweedie
At any given time. So obviously not everyone within the firm is required to do that. I’m huge, especially when it comes to our staff, I’m huge on respecting their work-life balance. When their time is up, it’s, Oh, it’s five o’clock. Yeah, you’re free to go. I try to respect that. So we are a go, go, go office. That’s the reality of our office. But we also recognize that people have lives and families, and we need to respect them when they go on lunch and all that. I’m probably not the greatest example if I’m being honest. But I’m passionate about respecting the work-life balance of the staff and lawyers.
[00:09:41.730] – Mickey Serebnitski
That leads actually into my next question. Especially on the COO side, what personal values or principles guide your approach to leadership?
[00:09:52.330] – Josiah Tweedie
What principles guide my approach to leadership? I think that a big one is what I just said, which was respecting that people have lives, trying to be empathetic, and trying to recognize that they have a life when they leave the office. They’ll come to me and say, Hey, I have this dentist appointment, or I have this doctor’s appointment, or I have just this vacation that I’m having. On the long weekend or whatever. I really, try to respect that because I think it pays dividends when you try to actively recognize that. And on top of that, it’s just a nice thing to do in my view. So I think empathy is a big one. I also think that the other part of a guiding principle, another guiding principle that I have is systematization. I try to not do stuff off the cuff. I try to not be random. I try to not be inconsistent. I try to be as consistent and predictable as humanly possible. So there’s a way that I take into account time off. There’s a way that There’s a way that I hire someone.
[00:11:32.660] – Josiah Tweedie
There’s a way that I train someone. I think since I’ve started with Guardian, I’ve tried to hone in what are the parts of my job that are a bit inconsistent and off the cuff and tried to streamline them and make them more consistent. I think those are the two things. Empathy, you have to be a human being. Two, you also have to run the business and be as consistent as possible. Again, I can’t say it correctly. Empathy and systematization.
[00:12:08.360] – Mickey Serebnitski
Awesome. I like it. How do you identify and implement innovative solutions, especially to improve the operations side, but also the client service side?
[00:12:17.180] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. So we have wonderful systems that we use. It is a difficult thing trying to learn how to properly take advantage of it, whether that’s managing the client so that they know, for example, where their files at, where their lawsuits at, whatever it happens to be, and keep them up to date. So I’m regularly trying to use the existing systems that we have to make it so that we’re delivering the best service that we possibly And as far as internally from a management perspective, I do use, for example, I do use a variety of things. For example, Indeed, when hiring new candidates or LinkedIn’s job posting feature. And I’m always on the lookout for better tools that I can leverage because I think Cosmolex, which is our internal accounting and matter management system, I’ve tried to take advantage of it the past little while, and it seems to be getting more and more advanced. I’d say that’s one of the big software suites that we use.
[00:13:53.340] – Mickey Serebnitski
Okay. Are there any other technology tools that you found have benefited the firm or things that you’re thinking of implementing, There’s CRM systems that often businesses use, or from the sales side and the management side, too. And are there tools that lawyers are using internally to manage their time effectively?
[00:14:11.160] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. So the one that I mentioned, Cosmolex, is an example of one of those prescribed systems. In Alberta, we have, I don’t know exactly. Last I checked, I think there were 20 or something software suites that you can use for accounting and practice management. Yeah. As an example, one thing that I’m just implementing now is an automatic booking system that clients can use to book new appointments just so that it saves a bit of time on our end of trying to fit it into a lawyer’s schedule.
[00:14:52.090] – Mickey Serebnitski
Is that for new clients or existing clients that are coming in for a secondary third meeting and fourth meeting?
[00:14:57.630] – Josiah Tweedie
I’m mostly gearing it towards new clients because there are a lot of steps that go into getting a new client set up. Law Society requirements are quite intense. But I do plan on expanding it and using it as much as possible. That I’m excited about.
[00:15:15.350] – Mickey Serebnitski
It’s cool. So I mean, attracting clients in specific niches requires a strategic target, right? Can you share any successful marketing or outreach methods that you and your teams have put together to build the book of business?
[00:15:32.020] – Josiah Tweedie
Okay. Yeah. So on top of us just properly managing our online presence, I guess. So that would include making sure our website is up to date, which is an ongoing struggle, by the way, updating our Google business profile and Apple business profile, the latter of which is more difficult as I’ve learned, as well as good old fashioned show up to events, hand out business cards, and just say, Hey, come by our office some time, come by our office sometime. Is that has been surprisingly successful? I don’t know if that’s just a Calgary thing, but it seems to be Word of mouth seems to be very valuable here. Beyond that, We seem to rank fairly high in SEO. If you were to search Calgary employment lawyer or something, we seem to come up pretty quickly. And I would say we’ve canvassed the feedback from new clients, and the majority of them seem to come from online searches.
[00:16:50.900] – Mickey Serebnitski
And do you have an internal team that works on digital marketing, so to speak, or do you outsource that?
[00:16:57.510] – Josiah Tweedie
We have mostly outsourced that stuff. What we’re finding is that SEO is Like digital marketing is something that you have to work at and pour money into. So you either have to jump in with both feet or not at all. So it’s something we’re always considering. But I have to say, with the amount of calls that we get every single week from new people, I don’t hugely see a need for it. Quite the opposite. I feel like too many people contact us. I’m joking, of course. Please, please contact us. But no, we’re really happy with how many people have wanted to, are interested in our services. Yeah.
[00:17:53.270] – Mickey Serebnitski
I find typically, I talk to business owners a lot and The best type of lead, so to speak, is a referral. Somebody that you’ve worked with, that you’ve done good work for, and they pass along the name. And then after that, it’s the organic online presence. And so that’s awesome that you guys are doing both.
[00:18:14.640] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, exactly. We’ve had so many times where we’ll take on one file and we’re like, this is not the greatest file in the world, but we’ll take it on. But then, sure enough, it just seems to multiply. Oh, yeah, it’s great.
[00:18:31.150] – Mickey Serebnitski
Cool. What are some common misconceptions that you encounter regarding the litigation process? And how do you educate the clients and then manage their expectations?
[00:18:41.550] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. So while I do not practice law, I have a ton of experience in it. And again, benefit from the lawyers in our firm who are very good at client expectations. And so that, to me, I is the key. Making it clear to them upfront what they’re in for. Different practices of law are different. But litigation in particular is famous for being, and rightly so, for being Long, expensive, and unpredictable. And so those are the three words that we use in setting expectations with clients. It’s going to take a long time, it’s going to be expensive, and we don’t know what’s going to happen at the end of the day. We can tell you, like I always say, we’re not fortune tellers. We never have been fortune tellers. We can tell you what our experience is, but that is not gospel. We still don’t know what happens when we show up for the application or trial in court. You still have no idea what’s going to happen. I think we’re good at making that clear. It does require reminders. Our clients need to be reminded of that throughout the process because people get impatient, which is fair. After all, when they come to us for a litigation problem, it’s probably because it’s the worst time of their life and they’re not thinking clearly and there are all these things happening, they’re stressed.
[00:20:19.400] – Josiah Tweedie
I think they appreciate when we’re just a grounding force. Hey, this is reality. This is where we’re at. We think I don’t think this is going to happen, but we don’t know for sure. I think. And that’s really what we are, is we’re consulting them on legal matters.
[00:20:39.640] – Mickey Serebnitski
It’s being super transparent, right?
[00:20:42.570] – Josiah Tweedie
A hundred %. Transparency is so important. We are not fortune tellers. That’s the main thing that I use. Well said.
[00:20:48.880] – Mickey Serebnitski
Well said. I think no case is like another, right? No. It’s very cool. Building relationships is important. Are there professional services that you guys jive well with and that you work together to build the business?
[00:21:09.180] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, I would say, realtors, or sorry, real estate agents, because as I understand, a realtor is a copyrighted term. That is a big thing. We work very closely with them Not just on our real estate side, but on just anything that they bring to us. It’s a really good business relationship to have. So that’s a big one. I would also say any of the other professional services. Dentists are a big one. Accountants, that’s another big one. Because similarly, we need accountants We are not accountants. I’m not an accountant. Just to be 100% clear, I manage the business. So there is some accounting, but I am not an accountant. Just to be 100% clear, I manage the business. There is some accounting, but I am not an accountant. We need help in our blind spots, and they need help in their blind spots. It’s really handy to just be like, Hey, I don’t know about this question. Can you or someone else figure this out? Oh, yeah, sure. And then we go find someone. Very old-school, very straightforward.
[00:22:29.540] – Mickey Serebnitski
Cool. Do you have a favorite client story? One that you can share.
[00:22:34.260] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. I always have to be very vague. But above all, I just find it gratifying when a client says to us, Hey, you guys got me out of a tough spot, and you guys acted like that for us. You didn’t delay. You acted as reasonably quickly as you could. So thank you for that. And there’s been lots of people who have said that to us. Obviously, can’t reveal any names, but that is hugely gratifying. And that’s what makes it worth it, as cliché as it sounds. I love that I’ve made a positive impact on someone’s life that they’re like, Oh, that wasn’t a completely horrible experience. I was handled well. It’s just It’s fine to me.
[00:23:30.560] – Mickey Serebnitski
A hundred %. It feels like you’re making a difference. And oftentimes, in day-to-day work, you don’t feel that. So when you can have a client, a conversation with a client and they tell that to you, it’s like, Okay, wait. What I’ve been doing for months is paying dividends and you’re happy.
[00:23:43.610] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, exactly. I know we had one guy recently who was grateful to us. And this guy had every right to be upset and pissed off and disappointed. Because some other council had let him down. We stepped in. We’re like, No, we’re taking this over, and we took it over, and he was over the moon.
[00:24:09.580] – Mickey Serebnitski
That’s awesome. You have experienced leadership with government officials. What are some effective negotiation tactics that you honed when dealing with government officials because things take time in the government? Yeah.
[00:24:22.750] – Josiah Tweedie
Because, again, every situation is a little bit different, I think some guiding principles that I have are, one, recognize that a given government employee is not personally invested in you and what you’re trying to do, and that they’re just trying to get through their day. So be respectful of the fact that they have a huge list of things to go through. So being respectful of their time is, I think, one of the main things. Two, make sure that your client knows that so that they, again, go back to what I was saying earlier, and have reasonable expectations about what they can reasonably expect. And three, I would say, as far as communication, you should work on explicit communication as much as possible. If you’re waiting for something, respectfully ask for an ETA. Like, when can we expect this? So that you can properly tell the client, okay, well, they’ll probably get back to us in a month. I don’t know that for sure, but they say that they will. Excuse me, something in my throat this morning. So I think those would be the three main things.
[00:25:46.570] – Mickey Serebnitski
For legal professionals in smaller firms or startups, what advice would you offer regarding developing and implementing effective SOPs? Standard of operators. Sorry. Standard of procedures.
[00:26:00.700] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. And so this is something that I think I’m qualified to speak on because I’ve done things the wrong way previously.
[00:26:11.530] – Mickey Serebnitski
Learning from our mistakes.
[00:26:12.970] – Josiah Tweedie
Exactly. I’ve learned a ton, again, from people who know more than I do. And so I think a big thing would be openness. I, in particular, am really bad for just getting tunnel vision of like, oh, this is the only way I know how to do this. And then you have someone come along and be like, why don’t you just do it this way? And you’re like, oh, wow. I can’t believe I didn’t think about that. As everyone in the office knows about me. So openness. That’s been a huge, huge difference maker in that you may not know the best way to do something, and feel free to canvas the opinion of everyone else. It doesn’t mean that you have to take what they say necessarily, but you take it into account. When you get advice or opinions from everyone else, it’s another tool that can sit in your toolbox. You don’t necessarily have to use that tool right then and there. But yeah, openness, I think, is the main thing. And above all, and again, being consistent about what you’re doing is so critical. When I tell someone how to do something, I better be consistent with how I tell someone else how to do the same thing.
[00:27:38.430] – Josiah Tweedie
So I think that’s where I think staff meetings can come in handy because I can speak to everyone at the same time. Now, there has rightly been a lot of criticism in the business world, I think, for useless staff meetings. Yeah. But I think that in the right context and for the right thing, there’s no better way than me standing in front of five or six people or something and being like, Hey, this is what we have to do. Here’s how you do it. It’s on a screen. You can all see it. There’s nothing that beats that, in my opinion, when it comes to training and implementing office procedures.
[00:28:22.440] – Mickey Serebnitski
Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. I find that, especially in the corporate world or in the office culture, it’s You have a cubicle and everyone is working away. Something I’ve implemented is Monday stand-up meetings. You come in to work, what’s everyone working on this week? And then if there’s anything high priority that I need to talk about or anybody else, the floor is open, and then we go back. It’s helpful, A, from a camaraderie perspective, too, building that team environment, but also for people to feel like they’re hurt. If you do need help, don’t be afraid to come to somebody else. You don’t have to take it on all yourself.
[00:29:00.440] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, absolutely. I just love the ability to talk to someone face-to-face and be like, I don’t know what it is. It’s just how we’re wired as humans. It’s the best way to communicate your expectations, and it’s the best way to communicate exactly what you’re talking about. Nothing beats it. But then what I do, again, to be consistent is once I’ve taught them in person, I’ll then make a policy document and procedure document codifying what I’ve said so that anyone can refer back to it. Then that becomes the statute, so to speak.
[00:29:37.640] – Mickey Serebnitski
The Holy Grail.
[00:29:38.590] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, of what they should be doing. Once they had the in-person, Oh, this is what we’re trying to do, type of understanding.
[00:29:47.860] – Mickey Serebnitski
Very cool. Are there any emerging trends in personal injury litigation that you see impacting the work in the coming years?
[00:29:55.960] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah. So the big thing would be the proposed switch to no-fault insurance, which is the system that they have in BC. And I hope that that does not happen. Number one, not only because it’s a core practice area. For those of you who don’t know, the no-fault system would effectively switch so that there would be no such thing as making an individualized claim. If you were injured, just like with a small whiplash injury, you’d get the same amount as if you got into a car accident and then got a much more serious injury, like a concussion or something like that. There would be a set amount that insurance companies would award you. So I’m not a fan of it, not only because it’s a core practice area, but two, because it limits the choice that injured people have in getting compensation, which is what we’re all about. When someone comes to us with a car accident injury, we are there with them for the long haul, whether that’s one year, five years, or 10 years, or however long it takes. This is nice because what I found is that injuries can develop and change over time.
[00:31:28.580] – Josiah Tweedie
If you just as an insurance company, shove 5,000 bucks in an injured party’s face, they might be like, Well, I only have a bit of soreness here. That’s probably fine, without recognizing that injuries can change over time. Then pretty soon, in two years, they might be like, Oh, I need surgery, and it is not covered by public health care. I’m not sure what to do. That’s the big change that I’m hoping will come where We don’t want it to come, but several parties wanted to come to Alberta.
[00:32:06.490] – Mickey Serebnitski
Is it like that in British Columbia already? Yeah. How long has that been in British Columbia?
[00:32:11.240] – Josiah Tweedie
I’m not sure, but I would think probably in Yeah, I’m not sure because I haven’t dealt with BC much at all.
[00:32:19.530] – Mickey Serebnitski
Do you see that coming down the pipeline in Alberta?
[00:32:23.040] – Josiah Tweedie
They’ve flirted with the idea, and a lot of the litigators are like, No, this is a bad idea for several reasons. I wonder if I can pull it up here. It’s called Fair, Fair, Alberta. Fairab.ca, if people want to learn more about it because that website can explain better than I possibly could.
[00:32:46.020] – Mickey Serebnitski
Okay, I’m looking at it right now. I’ll take a look at it after. Yeah.
[00:32:49.340] – Josiah Tweedie
It’s a larger conversation.
[00:32:51.270] – Mickey Serebnitski
Yeah, we’ll be here for it. Exactly.
[00:32:53.500] – Josiah Tweedie
I was just going to say, in summary, that’s what they’ve threatened with. That’s one of the changes that might be coming down the line, which would hugely impact our business and hugely impact Albertans who are injured. Yeah.
[00:33:12.540] – Mickey Serebnitski
Is there anything that excites you on the other side of it? Is there something that you see may be changing for the better for the clients? Outside of this not happening?
[00:33:22.300] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, exactly.
[00:33:24.610] – Mickey Serebnitski
Keeping its status quo?
[00:33:25.700] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, I’d say, just speaking very, very broadly, I think this is an interesting time for Alberta. It just feels like we’re shifting in a lot of ways, and it’s really difficult for me to say I know exactly where it’s going to go, but I feel a degree of optimism for one reason or another. That’s my extremely broad, unhelpful statement.
[00:33:54.020] – Mickey Serebnitski
Yeah. Well, you’re not on top, right?
[00:33:55.700] – Josiah Tweedie
Yeah, exactly.
[00:33:58.610] – Mickey Serebnitski
Cool. Awesome. That has gone through my questions here. Do you have anything that you want to share? Anything else that comes to mind?
[00:34:09.130] – Josiah Tweedie
I think just that I’m excited about this business and the ability that I’ve had to make not only our clients’ lives easier, but everyone who works there, myself included, to make their lives easier. And that’s my goal as a COO is like, I’ve worked in so many offices where I’ve been like, this is a stupid process. This is slow and inefficient and it accomplishes nothing. Now I have the chance to implement something and fix that experience in my mind that has just been like, why did we do it that way at that other office? Now I can make it mine. And I say not mine, as in I’m the only person in charge here or has an interest in it. Everyone has an interest in it, but I can be active and proactive in how I make it the best place to work, I can make it. That’s awesome.
[00:35:17.660] – Mickey Serebnitski
I’m excited to see what the future holds for you. I’ll keep an eye on keeping in touch and seeing how things progress over the next few months, and over the next few years. Thank you for taking the time to meet with me today. I’m going to put all your information in the descriptions of the videos. To our listeners out there, if you can please press subscribe. We’d be happy to have you and help us grow this channel and meet with more business leaders in and around Canada.
